Rendlesham Forest Encounter, updates to Burroughs' Story

[newyorklily]

I was looking at the Rendelsham thread and I saw that there wasn't anything about Kit Green's recent comments. I think what he said about why John Burroughs' medical records are classified is very important to the case. It could explain why the craft was there.

It has been rumored (and I've heard that some have confirmed it) that there were live nuclear missiles on that base. They weren't supposed to be there and it was basically illegal. Supposedly the craft sent a beam into the ground. I think that whatever the craft did caused the missiles to leak. This is what caused Burroughs' radiation burns, not the UFO itself. And this is why his medical records are still classified.

Rendelsham is a modern day "Malstrom" and therefore makes UFOs a security problem. It's the 700 pound gorilla in the room that no one wants to talk about.

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add note: The following dozen posts were part of a private staff debate that was deemed interesting enough to go public.
Feel free to join in. Enjoy!

[calikid]

I was looking at the Rendelsham thread and I saw that there wasn't anything about Kit Green's recent comments. I think what said about why John Burroughs' medical records are classified is very important to the case. It could explain why the craft was there.

It has been rumored (and I've heard that some have confirmed it) that there were live nuclear missiles on that base. They weren't supposed to be there and it was basically illegal. Supposedly the craft sent a beam into the ground. I think that whatever the craft did caused the missiles to leak. This is what caused Burroughs' radiation burns, not the UFO itself. And this is why his medical records are still classified.

Rendelsham is a modern day "Malstrom" and therefore makes UFOs a security problem. It's the 700 pound gorilla in the room that no one wants to talk about.

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Wasn't Burroughs' encounter off base in the forest?
Not on base, near weapons storage?

[newyorklily]

Wasn't Burroughs' encounter off base in the forest?
Not on base, near weapons storage?
I'm not sure where the base begins or ends. There is also an underground section of the base. The witnesses to the event were brought to an underground room for the debriefing with sodium pentothal and hypnosis. I'm not sure if it was Burroughs or Warren who saw trucks arrive a couple of days later to lift something out of the ground and take it away. Perhaps that was a damaged missile.

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[Dragonfire]

I'm not sure where the base begins or ends. There is also an underground section of the base. The witnesses to the event were brought to an underground room for the debriefing with sodium pentothal and hypnosis. I'm not sure if it was Burroughs or Warren who saw trucks arrive a couple of days later to lift something out of the ground and take it away. Perhaps that was a damaged missile.

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Burroughs was outside the perimeter of base fence in the woods along with others. They all had to "leave" the base to investigate the "lights".

[newyorklily]

Burroughs was outside the perimeter of base fence in the woods along with others. They all had to "leave" the base to investigate the "lights".
Ok. Then, where did the radiation, that damaged Burroughs' heart and eyes , originate? I think many feel that the burns happened when he was on the ground in the white light of the craft however, there has never been any mention of damage to the soil or plants in the area (including the trees). I think the elevated radiation that was detected was around the imprint area (where they made the casts).

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[Dragonfire]

Ok. Then, where did the radiation, that damaged Burroughs' heart and eyes , originate? I think many feel that the burns happened when he was on the ground in the white light of the craft however, there has never been any mention of damage to the soil or plants in the area (including the trees). I think the elevated radiation that was detected was around the imprint area (where they made the casts).

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According to both Burroughs and Penniston they were in the woods outside the base when the they encounter the craft on the ground and Burroughs touched it. That was also where they encounter the "light".

Sgt. Penniston asked Sgt. Steffens to go with him into the woods, but Steffens did not want to leave base property. So, John Burroughs volunteered to join Sgt. Penniston and Airman Cabansag. The three men traveled in a pickup truck from the East Gate toward the unusual, colorful lights in the forest.

[Dragonfire]

Jim Penniston remembers approaching the lights, seeing a solid black, glassy, triangle- shaped craft on the resting on the forest floor. He photographed the craft, he drew sketches of it in his notebook and copied the odd symbols scratched into the black, glassy surface. He walked off the size at 9 feet by 6.5 feet. But John Burroughs, who was there with Penniston, does not remember any of that. Later, Jim Penniston realized that his notebook’s time line had 45 minutes of missing time. Further, Airman Richard Bertolino on Bunker Hill was listening to Sgt. Penniston’s radio transmissions until Security Control called for radio silence about an hour after Sgt. Penniston and the other men went into the forest. John Burroughs recently talked with Lt. Fred Buran who said radio silence was requested because Security Control lost all radio contact with Sgt. Penniston for about 45 minutes.



Right from the beginning, the men saw what they could not explain and something happened to the minds of those eyewitnesses – either in the forest, in military interrogations later on, or both. The results have been blank or confused memories and efforts to break through mental blocks.

[newyorklily]

According to both Burroughs and Penniston they were in the woods outside the base when the they encounter the craft on the ground and Burroughs touched it. That was also where they encounter the "light".

Sgt. Penniston asked Sgt. Steffens to go with him into the woods, but Steffens did not want to leave base property. So, John Burroughs volunteered to join Sgt. Penniston and Airman Cabansag. The three men traveled in a pickup truck from the East Gate toward the unusual, colorful lights in the forest.
Burroughs didn't touch the craft, Penniston did. That's how he allegedly got the download of the binary codes.

Burroughs talks about falling down and the bright white light that came over him in this Paracast interview.
http://www.theparacast.com/podcast/now-playing-june-21-2009-john-burroughs-and-peter-robbins/

The forest is a strip of land that runs between the American and British sides of the base. That doesn't mean that there isn't something underground. We know that there are subterranean rooms because that's where the debriefings took place. Also, missiles aren't necessarily stored on a base. Off the coast of the Bronx is an island that was a Nike missile site. The tubes are still in the ground but (hopefully) there are no missiles. I don't think there has ever been a base in that area.

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[calikid]

The base is a designated NATO forward base. Authorized to store nuclear weapons within the secure weapons storage area. The same area, on base, which the "object" reportedly overflew and spotlighted.
IMHO, no benefit to storage of nukes outside the secure perimeter of the base fence line (ie nothing to hide, less secure).

I suspect Burroughs was irradiated by the craft's propulsion system, that possibly used some type of nuclear fuel. Maybe he did not touch it (missing time, cannot know for sure), but sounds like he was in close proximity.

[newyorklily]

The base is a designated NATO forward base. Authorized to store nuclear weapons within the secure weapons storage area. The same area, on base, which the "object" reportedly overflew and spotlighted.
IMHO, no benefit to storage of nukes outside the secure perimeter of the base fence line (ie nothing to hide, less secure).

I suspect Burroughs was irradiated by the craft's propulsion system, that possibly used some type of nuclear fuel. Maybe he did not touch it (missing time, cannot know for sure), but sounds like he was in close proximity.

http://www.theufochronicles.com/2010/12/rendleshambentwaters-ufo-case-had.html


During the early hours of December 26, 1980, USAF Security Policemen Jim Penniston, John Burroughs and Adrian Bustinza were attempting to discover the source of unexplained lights in Rendlesham Forest when they stumbled upon a landed, triangular-shaped UFO. What happened next has been written about in countless articles over the past 30 years. Less well known is the fact that other SPs, on duty at the nearby Weapons Storage Area (WSA), also reported a UFO hovering near the facility two nights later. At that time, the WSA held the largest stockpile of tactical nuclear bombs—also known as battlefield nukes—in Western Europe.

Just prior to the appearance of the UFO at the WSA, in the wee hours of December 28th, Bentwaters’ deputy base commander, then Lt. Col. Charles Halt, was leading a small group of SPs through Rendlesham Forest in an effort to identify the source of mysterious lights observed moving through the trees—the second such incident that week. In 1997, a retired Col. Halt spoke about the experience in an interview with journalist A.J.S. Rayl, saying,
“[After leaving the woods, our search team] crossed the farmer's field past his house and across the road, stumbled through a small stream, and went out into a large plowed field. Somebody noticed several objects in the sky—three objects clearly visible with multiple-colored lights on them. The objects appeared elliptical and then they turned full round, which I thought was quite interesting. All three doing that. They were stationary for awhile and then they started to move at high speed in sharp angular patterns as though they were doing a grid search.

About that same time, somebody noticed a similar object . It was round—did not change shape—and at one point it appeared to come toward us at a very high speed. It stopped overhead and sent down a small pencil-like beam, sort of like a laser beam. It was an interesting beam in that it stayed—it was the same size all the way down the beam. It illuminated the ground about ten feet from us and we just stood there in awe wondering whether it was a signal, a warning, or what it was. We really didn't know. It clicked-off as though someone threw a switch, and the object receded, back up into the sky.

Then it moved back toward Bentwaters, and continued to send down beams of light, at one point near the weapons storage facility. We knew that because we could hear the chatter on the [two-way] radio.”
Elaborating on this last point during a 1999 interview with author Georgina Bruni (http://www.theufochronicles.com/2008/11/beams-of-light-excerpt-from-ufos-and.html), Col. Halt said, “We heard radio conversations on the Law Enforcement frequency, the Security Police frequency, and the Command Network...We could hear talk about one of the objects [being] in the vicinity of the Bentwaters WSA. I heard that some of the beams, or whatever they were, came down into the WSA...[However,] I was several miles away. From my view, a beam or more came down near the WSA. I don’t know for a fact that the beams landed there. I know they were in the area. I was too far away [and so] relied on the radio chatter which indicated the beams landed there. We could see several beams and members in the WSA went on the radio to report them. Several airmen present later told me they saw the beams. I don’t remember any names at this point.”

Halt further discussed the incident at the WSA during a Sci Fi Channel television program, [I]UFO Invasion at Rendlesham (http://www.theufochronicles.com/2010/12/video-ufo-invasion-at-rendlesham.html), which first aired in December 2003. After some prodding by the show’s host, Bryant Gumble, a reluctant Halt stated, “The object to the south [of my position in the forest] was actually sending some beams down near, or into, the Weapons Storage Area. That caused me a great deal of concern. You know, what was it doing there? Was it searching for something, was it trying to—who knows what it was trying to do?” For a split second, it seemed as if Halt would say something like, “Was it trying to zap the nukes?” but caught himself before the words left his lips.

In 2007, I interviewed one of the SPs on duty at the WSA that night, Robert “Charlie” Waters. As I write in my book, UFOs and Nukes: Extraordinary Encounters at Nuclear Weapons Sites:
Waters told me, “There was some commotion in the WSA that night. Someone saw this object, I don’t remember who, and called out to us. I think my ART partner was Rob Isbell, but I’m not certain. But we looked and saw this spinning light—a multicolored light, I can’t really remember the colors—anyway, this craft was hovering and then slowly descended toward the forest. We ran up on one of the berms to get a better view of it. Then we reported it [to Central Security Control]. I remember I used a couple of expletives and was warned not to use profanity on the radio...The next morning, I talked to one of the operations officers who told me that [a small group of SPs] had gone out to the woods and had seen some burn marks on trees, about three feet off the ground. He said it looked like, whatever it was, had bounced from tree to tree coming down. The person who told me that wasn’t our flight’s shift commander. He was another officer, but I don’t remember his name.”

...I asked Waters to describe the UFO he and his ART partner saw, using my standard question, “If you held a dime at arm’s length, was it larger than that?” Waters immediately said, “Yes! I would say it was, when I first saw it, as large as a, uh, cantaloupe held at arm’s length! It was big! It was spinning and, I think, had a light on the bottom of it, but I’m not sure. I also think I saw something sticking out on the bottom, uh, like a rod or something like that.” I quickly asked Waters if he ever saw anything resembling a beam of light coming out of the UFO. “No, nothing like that, at least what I saw. Nothing coming out and going down to the ground, or anywhere else.”

I asked Waters if the UFO had ever been over the Weapons Storage Area itself. He replied, “Not that I saw. It never came directly over our heads. It stayed just over the trees and moved slowly from right to left until it, I think, disappeared behind them. To be honest, I don’t remember where it went, but it was descending when I saw it. It was pretty amazing. I didn’t immediately think “alien”, you know, I was just perplexed. Also, I remember the animals were going crazy. There were cows mooing and, uh, farm animal noises in the distance. It was almost like they were screaming!”

[calikid]

http://www.theufochronicles.com/2010/12/rendleshambentwaters-ufo-case-had.html
Sorry? Doesn't this make my points?

No ban existed on nukes.

Nukes were stored in WSA, not a secret underground room off base in the forest.

Burroughs was not near any leaking nukes during the incident he blames for his exposure.

I liked your original theory, shows thinking outside the box. :)

IMHO just do NOT feel the known facts add up to Burroughs getting dosed by a leaky (ET damaged) warhead

[newyorklily]

Sorry? Doesn't this make my points?

No ban existed on nukes.

Nukes were stored in WSA, not a secret underground room off base in the forest.

Burroughs was not near any leaking nukes during the incident he blames for his exposure.

I liked your original theory, shows thinking outside the box. :)

IMHO just do NOT feel the known facts add up to Burroughs getting dosed by a leaky (ET damaged) warhead

Burroughs never said that he got his illnesses from the craft, just that he was not sick when he signed up for the job. But, he did not get the radiation burns from being in the white light. I know because I've been in a similar white light. After the light covered him, he could no longer remember anything. Later, the memories were recovered in hypnosis. Consciously, he remembered the light as white but under hypnosis, he remembered it as blue. I think that strengthens his experience as being real. It's like "What color is the dress? White and gold or blue and black?".

In the Paracast interview, Burroughs says that on the Tuesday following the incidents, something was lifted out of the forest in a crate and taken away. Some think it might have been a crashed Russian satellite. Witnesses on the base said that the craft sent beams into the ground. There is a good chance that the missiles were tampered with.

I'm still looking for the references about the base not legally having the missiles. I think it might have had to do with a NATO treaty.

[calikid]

Burroughs never said that he got his illnesses from the craft, just that he was not sick when he signed up for the job. But, he did not get the radiation burns from being in the white light. I know because I've been in a similar white light. After the light covered him, he could no longer remember anything. Later, the memories were recovered in hypnosis. Consciously, he remembered the light as white but under hypnosis, he remembered it as blue. I think that strengthens his experience as being real. It's like "What color is the dress? White and gold or blue and black?".

In the Paracast interview, Burroughs says that on the Tuesday following the incidents, something was lifted out of the forest in a crate and taken away. Some think it might have been a crashed Russian satellite. Witnesses on the base said that the craft sent beams into the ground. There is a good chance that the missiles were tampered with.

I'm still looking for the references about the base not legally having the missiles. I think it might have had to do with a NATO treaty.



A crate?
Seems like a flatbed truck with tarps is the usual military M.O.
Wonder what that could have been?

Holt seems like a pretty straight shooter, funny he never mentioned such an excavation.

[calikid]

The recent admission by the USAF that John Burroughs did in fact experience health issues directly related to his 1980 encounter, opens up serious questions about the source of his exposure.

[Dragonfire]

John Burroughs is one of the primary witnesses to a mass UFO sighting in December, 1980. He and others saw UFOs on multiple nights near the Bentwaters Royal Air Force Base in Suffolk, UK, which was on lease to the US Air Force. Now he is suffering from medical issues that may be related to these events, but is being denied his military medical records. In fact, the USAF denied Burroughs was in the military at all in 1980, but they have fixed this “error” at the behest of a request from Arizona Senator John McCain’s office.

[Dragonfire]

From: http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/news/278759/airman-wins-payout-over-rendlesham-ufo

An American airman has received compensation after suffering radiation poisoning during the encounter.

It's one of Britain's best known UFO cases and one that still remains unexplained more than twenty years later.

The incident occurred in December 1980 at Rendlesham Forest, England where a strange object appeared over multiple nights and was witnessed by several members of the military including Lt. Col. Charles Halt who famously recorded what was happening on audio tape while he and his men were investigating the craft.

One of the airmen who was there at the time however, John Burroughs, was exposed to so much radiation that he later developed a heart problem and had to undergo surgery.

Now after being denied compensation for years the US Veteran's Association has finally agreed to pay for his treatment, a move that has been hailed as an admission that UFOs can cause harm.

"I was not looking for anyone to believe me," he said. "All I have been concerned about was getting care for my illness. That was all that mattered."

Burroughs and colleague Jim Penniston had ventured much closer to the object than the other men in an effort to learn as much as possible about it. Penniston later described how it had been silver in color and noted that it had also been covered in strange symbols similar to heiroglyphics.

"I think this is a phenomenon the government is aware of, but are still trying to work out what it is," said Burroughs. "We had a very weird experience. There is clearly something strange going on."

From Open Minds Radio

[Dragonfire]

Here are the original statements provided by five of the participants on the first night of the Rendlesham Forest UFO sighting (1980 December 26). The statements are presented in alphabetical order of the witness’s name. Click on the link below. It takes you to page two where the written statements can be found. Page one is also very interesting.


Witness statements can be found here: http://www.ianridpath.com/ufo/rendlesham2c.htm

[Chris]

The base is a designated NATO forward base. Authorized to store nuclear weapons within the secure weapons storage area. The same area, on base, which the "object" reportedly overflew and spotlighted.
IMHO, no benefit to storage of nukes outside the secure perimeter of the base fence line (ie nothing to hide, less secure).

I suspect Burroughs was irradiated by the craft's propulsion system, that possibly used some type of nuclear fuel. Maybe he did not touch it (missing time, cannot know for sure), but sounds like he was in close proximity.

My understanding from inside sources involved in the medical examinations is that it does not require an actual physical touching of the craft or the occupants, but a close enough proximity can produce the same results in Burroughs as occurred with Penniston.

[majicbar]

A crate?
Seems like a flatbed truck with tarps is the usual military M.O.
Wonder what that could have been?

Holt seems like a pretty straight shooter, funny he never mentioned such an excavation.

Extraction of such a crate would have been done under the "Moonbeam", or subsequent designator, knowledge would have been under the control of MAJIC, MAJESTIC and as such been need to know only. Halt would not have need to know, it would have fallen to the Base Commander, not Vice Commander for any decisions. Once initiated it is likely that any crews doing such an extraction were a separate operation and need not have any contact with base personnel, including officers, to do the job.

Radioactive exhaust gasses would have been enough to expose Burrows to radiation. A total logical failure of it's flight computer would have rendered the craft immobile, perhaps the craft had it's reactor go critical in order to prevent the computers inside from falling into our hands.

[newyorklily]

Extraction of such a crate would have been done under the "Moonbeam", or subsequent designator, knowledge would have been under the control of MAJIC, MAJESTIC and as such been need to know only. Halt would not have need to know, it would have fallen to the Base Commander, not Vice Commander for any decisions. Once initiated it is likely that any crews doing such an extraction were a separate operation and need not have any contact with base personnel, including officers, to do the job.

Radioactive exhaust gasses would have been enough to expose Burrows to radiation. A total logical failure of it's flight computer would have rendered the craft immobile, perhaps the craft had it's reactor go critical in order to prevent the computers inside from falling into our hands.

You're assuming that it was an alien craft that was extracted. I'm thinking that it was a nuclear missile that was damaged by the alien craft.

[newyorklily]

My understanding from inside sources involved in the medical examinations is that it does not require an actual physical touching of the craft or the occupants, but a close enough proximity can produce the same results in Burroughs as occurred with Penniston.

Burroughs had the most severe illnesses from those nights. Much more severe than Penniston. If the radiation came from the craft, then Penniston should have had the more severe illness since he was the one to actually touch it. Or, why didn't all those who came near the craft get the same amount of damage to their health?

Even more of a question in my mind: Why don't we hear of abductees coming down with radiation poisoning?

[newyorklily]

Here are the original statements provided by five of the participants on the first night of the Rendlesham Forest UFO sighting (1980 December 26). The statements are presented in alphabetical order of the witness’s name. Click on the link below. It takes you to page two where the written statements can be found. Page one is also very interesting.


Witness statements can be found here: http://www.ianridpath.com/ufo/rendlesham2c.htm

I take anything that Ian Ridpath writes on the Rendlesham topic with a grain of salt. Ridpath determined that what they all saw on those three nights was the lighthouse. That theory has already been debunked.

[newyorklily]

This is a very good interview of John Burroughs, recorded in 2009. Peter Robbins (whose main source is Larry Warren) is also interviewed here and confirms everything that Burroughs says.

http://www.theparacast.com/podcast/now-playing-june-21-2009-john-burroughs-and-peter-robbins/

[majicbar]

You're assuming that it was an alien craft that was extracted. I'm thinking that it was a nuclear missile that was damaged by the alien craft.

If it had been a missile that was nuclear tipped it would have been a cruise missile, which were stored in the nuclear bunkers as well. ( Cruise missiles were carried by F-111, F-4, F-15's from English bases at that time. ) As such it would have been on it's transfer dolly and would not have needed to be transferred by helicopter, it could have easily been towed for transport on a C-141, or C-5 back to the U.S. for inspection and analysis, most likely at Wright Patterson Foreign Technology labs, inspecting for foreign technology altering the missile/warhead. The same goes for any warheads that would have been altered or destroyed. Anything which was ours would have been easily transported, short of it being radioactive, but which then would have required some specialized handling. But were that the case if they had time to crate it they had time to shield it. Crating would have also shielded it from view of those without need to know. If the item at question were an alien craft as where Halt, Burrows and Pennington found it in amongst the trees of the forest, vertical extraction by helicopter would have been required. Building a road into the forest would have left traces that would lead right to the site and getting "it" away cleanly would I think be a priority.

[Fore]

A crate?
Seems like a flatbed truck with tarps is the usual military M.O.
Wonder what that could have been?

Holt seems like a pretty straight shooter, funny he never mentioned such an excavation.Interesting thread.

Most likely, as my guess, the crate probably contained a cut out of the ground where the craft may have come closest to depositing something on the environment. I would think they would have wanted to test the ground (and other artifacts) irradiated by the craft. Probably to figure out what that backwash was full of and thereby identifying where it has been. Probably for identifying the radioactive characteristics to run it against a database of known profiles?

Various references (not the best, I admit):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUjPeXskVqo <--- Explains what the field around the craft may have captured on it's way down into our atmosphere. Perhaps even some traces from different geographies? Who knows?

This one has the main point in the very end of the video (last few seconds):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiOzQ-K0gEQ

And some guy explaining how to do a basic spectroscopy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpphHHnmh0g <--- Which brings the question, could the group of men have walked right above a hidden chamber that contained some kind of technology made by our government? Sensing equipment to capture UFO data? (it's a stretch of the imagination but with an unlimited budget and bright people, you never know what they might invent.)

[Fore]

Burroughs had the most severe illnesses from those nights. Much more severe than Penniston. If the radiation came from the craft, then Penniston should have had the more severe illness since he was the one to actually touch it. Or, why didn't all those who came near the craft get the same amount of damage to their health?

Even more of a question in my mind: Why don't we hear of abductees coming down with radiation poisoning?Probably because the standard procedure is to ~ventilate~ the external fields prior to contact. Though there are no assurances that is always the case.

In this case, some of the encounters are unplanned events.

Not all UFO's cause burn marks on the ground (or the surroundings) they land on/near.

[newyorklily]

Probably because the standard procedure is to ~ventilate~ the external fields prior to contact. Though there are no assurances that is always the case.

In this case, some of the encounters are unplanned events.

Not all UFO's cause burn marks on the ground (or the surroundings) they land on/near.

I have to wonder if the light in my experience in 1987 was similar to the light at Rendlesham.


In August, 1987, I was taken out of my building. I was upright as though I was walking down the stairs but the movement was more like floating. I felt very calm and detached and I now believe that I was in a trance. There was a man behind me who was wearing a poorly fitted suit. I think I looked over my right shoulder at him once. His necktie was flying around a bit and he had no face.
We were going to a car that was across the street from my building. It was an old car from the 1940s or ‘50s with a round top (something like today’s P T Cruiser but larger), and was dark green to black in color.(Every time I’ve tried to draw that car, it comes out looking like a saucer with a dome.) I got into the car. The side windows had water on them but the front window was clear. The vehicle began to move and went down the edge of the street until it came to where Terrace View Avenue met Teunissen Place. Then it went over the low fence on the right and floated down to the athletic field of John F. Kennedy High School. As it descended, it looked like the whole field was bright white. I thought, “Isn’t that nice, snow in August.” It wasn’t snow. The field was flooded in bright white light. There was someone on the field, dressed in a white suit from head to toe. I knew what that suit was called but I couldn’t bring the word to mind. Years later I could put the word to it. It was a haz-mat suit, complete with hood. I don’t remember anything after that.

[calikid]

Burroughs had the most severe illnesses from those nights. Much more severe than Penniston. If the radiation came from the craft, then Penniston should have had the more severe illness since he was the one to actually touch it. Or, why didn't all those who came near the craft get the same amount of damage to their health?

Even more of a question in my mind: Why don't we hear of abductees coming down with radiation poisoning?
I saw a recent TV interview where Burroughs claims hypno recovered memory of going inside the craft (in the animated re-creation the craft was bigger on the inside, than on the outside). He was in a room filled with crystals, a door opened and a crystal entity that resembled a large 6 foot tall snake (at least to me) swayed before him.
Maybe that is where he was exposed to radiation.

Penniston was not with him (in the recovered memory) inside the craft
So less exposure outside = less injury/illness.

Just a theory...

[newyorklily]

I saw a recent TV interview where Burroughs claims hypno recovered memory of going inside the craft (in the animated re-creation the craft was bigger on the inside, than on the outside). He was in a room filled with crystals, a door opened and a crystal entity that resembled a large 6 foot tall snake (at least to me) swayed before him.
Maybe that is where he was exposed to radiation.

Penniston was not with him (in the recovered memory) inside the craft
So less exposure outside = less injury/illness.

Just a theory...
Can you give me a link to that interview or the name of the program? This is a new one. It was reported that while Burroughs was in the light he was out of radio contact for about 25 minutes and has no memory of what happened. If those memories are accurate (I'm always suspicious when hypnosis is used), then it is a dramatic 360 degree turn. Burroughs always said that he would never say there was an entity or alien in the object. Also, a snake in the craft is very different than what Penniston and Burroughs has been saying--that it is from our future.

There is also the question of why wasn't the giant snake irradiated as well? Radiation is an equal opportunity destroyer. It doesn't discriminate based on species.

Sent from my LGLS660 using Tapatalk

[majicbar]

Can you give me a link to that interview or the name of the program? This is a new one. It was reported that while Burroughs was in the light he was out of radio contact for about 25 minutes and has no memory of what happened. If those memories are accurate (I'm always suspicious when hypnosis is used), then it is a dramatic 360 degree turn. Burroughs always said that he would never say there was an entity or alien in the object. Also, a snake in the craft is very different than what Penniston and Burroughs has been saying--that it is from our future.

There is also the question of why wasn't the giant snake irradiated as well? Radiation is an equal opportunity destroyer. It doesn't discriminate based on species.

Sent from my LGLS660 using Tapatalk

http://www.therendleshamforestincident.com/Home.html

http://www.therendleshamforestincident.com/Hypnosis_Z0DU.html

http://www.therendleshamforestincident.com/Burroughs_Hypnosis_2.html

http://www.therendleshamforestincident.com/Penniston_Hypnosis.html

This should help with the resources question for newyorklily, the information on the official website should be solid.

[newyorklily]

http://www.therendleshamforestincident.com/Home.html

http://www.therendleshamforestincident.com/Hypnosis_Z0DU.html

http://www.therendleshamforestincident.com/Burroughs_Hypnosis_2.html

http://www.therendleshamforestincident.com/Penniston_Hypnosis.html

This should help with the resources question for newyorklily, the information on the official website should be solid.

Thank you, majicbar. Those links are interesting, especially the one with Burroughs hypnosis. However, I would still like to see the TV show (or, at least, the link) that calikid is referring to. The hypnosis transcript on the third link, does not mention anything about snakes.

[calikid]

Can you give me a link to that interview or the name of the program? This is a new one. It was reported that while Burroughs was in the light he was out of radio contact for about 25 minutes and has no memory of what happened. If those memories are accurate (I'm always suspicious when hypnosis is used), then it is a dramatic 360 degree turn. Burroughs always said that he would never say there was an entity or alien in the object. Also, a snake in the craft is very different than what Penniston and Burroughs has been saying--that it is from our future.

There is also the question of why wasn't the giant snake irradiated as well? Radiation is an equal opportunity destroyer. It doesn't discriminate based on species.

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It has been a few weeks ago that I saw it.
But the hypno sessions discussed were VERY recent, maybe even 2015.
I will research the show name, get back to you.
Also, snake is my word for the animated entity, not Burroughs'.
Could have been a crystal mechanical arm, for all I know.

[majicbar]

https://youtu.be/gtGeauVK4ww

Is this the hypnosis session?

More clips, from an original but this is poor quality copy:

https://youtu.be/F5zI-IEMxps

This may be another version of the first:

https://youtu.be/UW5GVNl0vho

[newyorklily]

https://youtu.be/gtGeauVK4ww

Is this the hypnosis session?

More clips, from an original but this is poor quality copy:

https://youtu.be/F5zI-IEMxps

This may be another version of the first:

https://youtu.be/UW5GVNl0vho

Thank you, majicbar. Yes, I think the first and third videos are about the same but I will have to listen to the first one again.

In the third video at around 4:15, Burroughs says that the ground is shaking which would indicate that something is wrong underground. Was the shaking caused by the craft or the light from the craft? Could the shaking indicate that a missile was damaged?

[majicbar]

Thank you, majicbar. Yes, I think the first and third videos are about the same but I will have to listen to the first one again.

In the third video at around 4:15, Burroughs says that the ground is shaking which would indicate that something is wrong underground. Was the shaking caused by the craft or the light from the craft? Could the shaking indicate that a missile was damaged?

I have been in several situations where the atmospheric revirbiration is so strong that the ground was shaking. While this felt like a small earthquake it was only induced by sound. These video segments lead me to believe that there is still move video out there that has not been released, and or, is in the control of others. It may be that which was the source of the video where Burrows talks of communication with some kind of entity. I also suspect that there may be material being held for yet another book.

[Fore]

I have to wonder if the light in my experience in 1987 was similar to the light at Rendlesham.

I always wondered about that incident and why you refered to it as snow.

It would make alot of sense if you were looking down and you saw a field covered in bright intense white light. From an imaging standpoint I can imagine the representation looking over exposed.

------------------------

There are a couple of thoughts coming to mind due to what I think about.

One of them is the strange realization (from what you depict) is that the individual in the field is wearing the "hazmat suit" and is seemingly waiting. The things that would stick out in my mind are several.

For example, is Lily looking at the scenery from outside the craft (really unlikely in my mind), so that brings into consideration that you are probably looking at the scene from the inside. Then, that begs the question, is she looking at it from a porthole or a screen or an interior surface that acts like a projection screen?

Next, the thought wanders into my mind of how long is she looking at the scene? Is she observing any kind of visual distortions represented at what she is looking at? (for example, does the craft shift modes while in flight or on it's final approach towards the field covered in bright light?)

Last, the interesting thought comes to my mind as to why the guy in the field illuminated below is wearing a hazmat suit. Are they aware that the ET could clean the exterior so that the hazmat isn't necessary? Or is it a more flexible option due to timing, better to have one than not?

And are the man on the ground and the ET craft on the same phase or does the crafts pilot consider it prudent to simply light up the entire area? <--- See notes

Note1: The reason I ask is because I have heard from multiple ET's over the years that they can schedule pickups and drop offs for each other and remain unobservable even when not inside a craft.

In other words, they can (they claimed) schedule a pickup in a populated area like a park if necessary and be completely unobservable. The craft can approach invisibly on one phase, the ET being picked up would be standing there in the park on the same phase. When the pilot got there, they other ET hops in, and none of the people in the park would notice the events.

Note2: It wasn't until years later that I heard about abductees who described physical abductions and saw other people (neighbors) while being abducted but the neighbors were seemingly unaware of oblivious to any strangeness occurring around them. Some of them claimed to walk through their own homes walls.

Which implied that it's possible for covert abductions events even in broad daylight. The only problem is (and I have heard this first hand from the ET near me) that the pilot of a nearby craft has to synch up to those on the ground on occasion. Which begs the question, as they transition between phases, do they appear for a moment in normal (unphased) space?

------------------

Is the man in the field with the hazmat suit, unphased/phased? IF unphased, did the ET pilot consider that much light in a field would draw attention? Or is the man in the hazmat suit already on a seperate phase and no one is going to notice the events taking place?

And if Lily is watching the approach (from what I suppose) is the inside, does she notice anything which gives away some insight into any of this? Those are all the thoughts crossing my mind when reading that segment.

[majicbar]

Back-in-the-day I disliked losing Windows95. For the most-part, seems updates for operating systems expire before the computer does.

So it occurs to me that Penniston puts his hand on the symbols and gets the message that the "device" is undergoing a repair routine, maybe it was undergoing an update, Windows 798 running on an Intel 5686, and it still does not work right.

[calikid]

So it occurs to me that Penniston puts his hand on the symbols and gets the message that the "device" is undergoing a repair routine, maybe it was undergoing an update, Windows 798 running on an Intel 5686, and it still does not work right.

Funny stuff!

Maybe it was undergoing repairs.
I have always wondered about the WILD disparity between this first sighting of an actual physical craft, vs the sightings over the next few days of EYEBALLS, DRIPPING METAL, LIGHTS that broke into 5 pieces.
Perhaps the on board camouflage was not working on the initial encounter, and subsequent encounters the viewers were treated to a dazzling light show projection to confuse their senses.

[calikid]

I've been trying to research the title of the episode I viewed.
My TiVO did me a solid and recorded it as a "recommendation".
At first I thought it was a segment I had already seen, same old Rendlesham story, a decent segment but, <yawn> nothing new.
Mistaken for old program: UFO FILES (https://video.search.yahoo.com/video/play;_ylt=A86.JyFGJzVVdVwAgT8nnIlQ;_ylu=X3oDMTB0aW RtNmFyBHNlYwNzYwRjb2xvA2dxMQR2dGlkA1lIUzAwMV8x?p=b ritain%27s+x+files+the+rendlesham+files&tnr=21&vid=A38D88D42BDB4EC55C70A38D88D42BDB4EC55C70&l=2718&turl=http%3A%2F%2Fts3.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DWN.4 CPodORyNiCYmKu2ru2APA%26pid%3D15.1&sigi=11v45itbo&rurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dp Sbaj2PkpFg&sigr=11b6i3c4p&tt=b&tit=UFO+Files%2C+Britain%26%2339%3Bs+Roswell%2C+Th e+Rendlesham+UFO+Incident!&sigt=11un065q9&back=https%3A%2F%2Fsearch.yahoo.com%2Fyhs%2Fsearch %3Fp%3Dbritains%2Bx%2Bfiles%2Bthe%2Brendlesham%2Bf iles%26hsimp%3Dyhs-004%26hspart%3Dmozilla%26fr%3Dyhs-mozilla-004%26ei%3DUTF-8&sigb=144qiur1f&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-004): Britain's Roswell, The Rendlesham UFO Incident.

But after watching it, and seeing NEW information posted, I recall looking twice at the title and notice it was released in 2015.
Britain's X-Files (http://www.disclose.tv/news/Britains_Roswell_the_truth_behind_the_Rendlesham_F orest_UFO_incident/114273): the truth behind the Rendlesham Forest UFO incident (2015)

Without seeing it again, I'm not 100% sure, but fairly confident this was the episode that featured Burroughs' newly recovered memories.

It was recorded from either SciFy or History channel a few weeks ago.

[majicbar]

Funny stuff!

Maybe it was undergoing repairs.
I have always wondered about the WILD disparity between this first sighting of an actual physical craft, vs the sightings over the next few days of EYEBALLS, DRIPPING METAL, LIGHTS that broke into 5 pieces.
Perhaps the on board camouflage was not working on the initial encounter, and subsequent encounters the viewers were treated to a dazzling light show projection to confuse their senses.

I have been taking it that several "alien", "future" entities may have been conducting operations over these nights. My take is that the "Penniston" contact was a craft from "our" future. The other sightings of lights and more ephemeral craft were multi-dimensional and more truly alien. It seems to me that there was some kind of "intervention" taking place, maybe perhaps something would have taken place but they came to take these nukes off-line and unusable, thus avoiding some outcome that changed the history timelines in a desirable way for them. Perhaps there is an exception to the hands off rule when there is intervention that closes negative timelines. This however might cause big problems when dealing with consequences with souls on the other side and the karmic implications of the development of souls in timelines that are changed. In the all universal multiverses concept this seems heavy handed as those timelines that are changed for our benefit are still there and lived, if that concept is valid: maybe not?

[newyorklily]

I always wondered about that incident and why you refered to it as snow.

It would make alot of sense if you were looking down and you saw a field covered in bright intense white light. From an imaging standpoint I can imagine the representation looking over exposed.

------------------------

There are a couple of thoughts coming to mind due to what I think about.

One of them is the strange realization (from what you depict) is that the individual in the field is wearing the "hazmat suit" and is seemingly waiting. The things that would stick out in my mind are several.

For example, is Lily looking at the scenery from outside the craft (really unlikely in my mind), so that brings into consideration that you are probably looking at the scene from the inside. Then, that begs the question, is she looking at it from a porthole or a screen or an interior surface that acts like a projection screen?

Next, the thought wanders into my mind of how long is she looking at the scene? Is she observing any kind of visual distortions represented at what she is looking at? (for example, does the craft shift modes while in flight or on it's final approach towards the field covered in bright light?)

Last, the interesting thought comes to my mind as to why the guy in the field illuminated below is wearing a hazmat suit. Are they aware that the ET could clean the exterior so that the hazmat isn't necessary? Or is it a more flexible option due to timing, better to have one than not?

And are the man on the ground and the ET craft on the same phase or does the crafts pilot consider it prudent to simply light up the entire area? <--- See notes

Note1: The reason I ask is because I have heard from multiple ET's over the years that they can schedule pickups and drop offs for each other and remain unobservable even when not inside a craft.

In other words, they can (they claimed) schedule a pickup in a populated area like a park if necessary and be completely unobservable. The craft can approach invisibly on one phase, the ET being picked up would be standing there in the park on the same phase. When the pilot got there, they other ET hops in, and none of the people in the park would notice the events.

Note2: It wasn't until years later that I heard about abductees who described physical abductions and saw other people (neighbors) while being abducted but the neighbors were seemingly unaware of oblivious to any strangeness occurring around them. Some of them claimed to walk through their own homes walls.

Which implied that it's possible for covert abductions events even in broad daylight. The only problem is (and I have heard this first hand from the ET near me) that the pilot of a nearby craft has to synch up to those on the ground on occasion. Which begs the question, as they transition between phases, do they appear for a moment in normal (unphased) space?

------------------

Is the man in the field with the hazmat suit, unphased/phased? IF unphased, did the ET pilot consider that much light in a field would draw attention? Or is the man in the hazmat suit already on a seperate phase and no one is going to notice the events taking place?

And if Lily is watching the approach (from what I suppose) is the inside, does she notice anything which gives away some insight into any of this? Those are all the thoughts crossing my mind when reading that segment.

In order to keep to the topic of this thread, I will post here about one of my experiences with the bright, white light. However, I will be posting more about it in My Encounters thread.

I was looking from inside a craft but I don’t think the craft I was in was the source of the bright, white light. I was floated out of my building (with an escort), across the street and into a vehicle that looked like an old styled car. There were no seats inside the vehicle. There were windows on the sides and the front. There was a light, misty rain that night and I could see water droplets on the side windows. The front window was clear and I watched through it as the vehicle moved down the dirt edge of the sidewalk, then on to the concrete where it floated higher and over the small fence. It then floated down to the athletic field. This is when I saw that the field was bright white and I thought it was snow in August. As it descended I saw the small being (about 2 feet tall). I thought he was dressed in a hazmat suit because he was all in white (but not as bright white as the surrounding area) and was black across where the eyes should be. The craft I was in continued to descend but I have no memories after the craft reached about 20 feet over the ground. I don’t know if I blacked out or I just don’t have any conscious memories of what happened after that point.

I had thought that the reason no one in my neighborhood mentioned the bright, white light that night was because they were used to seeing lights in the area. Frequently on summer nights, there would be helicopters searching for teenagers who either fell into the river or was hit by a train while walking on the tracks. Now, I’m beginning to wonder if the white light can only be seen while in an altered state of consciousness. During this experience, I felt the same way I do when I am in a hypnotic trance. The imagery of descending something is frequently used to deepen a trance and might be the reason why I have no recollections below 20 feet. Burroughs, in the Paracast interview, mentions that everything felt like it was going slower. This is a common illusion during “fight or flight” but, it is a change in the brain. Was it enough to bring about an altered state of consciousness to see the bright, white light?

[majicbar]

In order to keep to the topic of this thread, I will post here about one of my experiences with the bright, white light. However, I will be posting more about it in My Encounters thread.

I was looking from inside a craft but I don’t think the craft I was in was the source of the bright, white light. I was floated out of my building (with an escort), across the street and into a vehicle that looked like an old styled car. There were no seats inside the vehicle. There were windows on the sides and the front. There was a light, misty rain that night and I could see water droplets on the side windows. The front window was clear and I watched through it as the vehicle moved down the dirt edge of the sidewalk, then on to the concrete where it floated higher and over the small fence. It then floated down to the athletic field. This is when I saw that the field was bright white and I thought it was snow in August. As it descended I saw the small being (about 2 feet tall). I thought he was dressed in a hazmat suit because he was all in white (but not as bright white as the surrounding area) and was black across where the eyes should be. The craft I was in continued to descend but I have no memories after the craft reached about 20 feet over the ground. I don’t know if I blacked out or I just don’t have any conscious memories of what happened after that point.

I had thought that the reason no one in my neighborhood mentioned the bright, white light that night was because they were used to seeing lights in the area. Frequently on summer nights, there would be helicopters searching for teenagers who either fell into the river or was hit by a train while walking on the tracks. Now, I’m beginning to wonder if the white light can only be seen while in an altered state of consciousness. During this experience, I felt the same way I do when I am in a hypnotic trance. The imagery of descending something is frequently used to deepen a trance and might be the reason why I have no recollections below 20 feet. Burroughs, in the Paracast interview, mentions that everything felt like it was going slower. This is a common illusion during “fight or flight” but, it is a change in the brain. Was it enough to bring about an altered state of consciousness to see the bright, white light?

It occurs to me that if there is a sufficiently greater change in time frequency in the experienced event, then what is white light within the experience will be shifted in visual frequency in our timeline, if the experienced time is much compressed then the frequency will be shifted up into the ultraviolet range, and thus unseen by those in the normal timeline. This also squares in my opinion with being able to travel through walls and windows as if they weren't there, as atoms are creatures of frequency and in the experienced event the frequency of atoms must be changed as well.

[newyorklily]

It occurs to me that if there is a sufficiently greater change in time frequency in the experienced event, then what is white light within the experience will be shifted in visual frequency in our timeline, if the experienced time is much compressed then the frequency will be shifted up into the ultraviolet range, and thus unseen by those in the normal timeline. This also squares in my opinion with being able to travel through walls and windows as if they weren't there, as atoms are creatures of frequency and in the experienced event the frequency of atoms must be changed as well.

I don't know what theory you are going by. I tend to lean on String Theory (or Superstring Theory). While it says that time travel is possible, it also indicates that time travel is irrelevant. If our future selves come back to stop a nuclear war, it would just create an alternate timeline without the nuclear war. The original timeline with the war would still be in existence. I don't think that the beings are from our future because what they are doing is futile. They really haven't changed anything.

http://mkaku.org/home/articles/the-physics-of-time-travel/


Recently, attempts to add the quantum theory to gravity (and hence create a “theory of everything”) have given us some insight into the paradox problem. In the quantum theory, we can have multiple states of any object. For example, an electron can exist simultaneously in different orbits (a fact which is responsible for giving us the laws of chemistry). Similarly, Schrodinger’s famous cat can exist simultaneously in two possible states: dead and alive. So by going back in time and altering the past, we merely create a parallel universe. So we are changing someone ELSE’s past by saving, say, Abraham Lincoln from being assassinated at the Ford Theater, but our Lincoln is still dead. In this way, the river of time forks into two separate rivers.

However, interdimensional travel could be mistaken as time travel since in some dimensions of string theory, everything is one.

http://www.universetoday.com/48619/a-universe-of-10-dimensions/

Bright white light is also experienced by people who have had near death experiences (NDEs). I am wondering if both travel along the same dimensional routes.

[majicbar]

Disclaimer, the following is from my own research and will leave most of you, if not all thinking, WTF?

Important parts of the present quantum hypothesis are actually incorrect because we have built some illusions into it which are without justification. There are aspects of the quantum hypothesis which are undoubtedly true, sorting them out and coming to all correct views of that physics will be this century's great task in physics. I am certain that some form of the string hypothesis, or it's offspring, will be found to be a correct foundation for this physics. The rediscovery of a fundamental ether is certainly the smallest, most fundamental string of which everything is made. The initial big bang was the generation of this ether, as it cooled these strings began to join and as they got longer they became matter. The ether then was able to push off this matter and the expansion of the big bang as we have envisioned it began, a second big bang we call inflation. We have found that within an entrained ether the speed of light is a constant we call "c". From the origin of the Universe the expansion is uniform throughout, but the edges of the Universe are expanding at less than "c" relative to the ether which is also still expanding at "C". Some of the Universe is expanding relative to the rest of the Universe at speeds faster than "c", yet none of it is expanding faster than "c" in the ether, the limit of expansion is "c" squared. That e=mc^, is no accident.

There are not 10 dimensions, there are 11. The 10 dimensional hypothesis is wrong. Space is constructed of two folded four triangle icosahedrons, take the two icosahedrons superimposed upon each other, raise it along one edge until the opposite edge is parallel to the surface against which the base is supported. Now twist the superimposed icosahedron 90 degrees to the edge of the other icosahedron. We now have a complex, closely packed solid which has 8 vertices of equal length and unique dimension, unknown in our physical world. Now connect the exterior points of the closest points of each of the triangles, making a cube of three dimensions. This cube connects the eight points of the inscribed triangles with 11 vertices about it's center. This defines space in a fundamental way which is scalable and geometric. The 10 dimension hypothesis while mathematical is not geometric, geometry should be a fundamental requirement of our cosmology guiding our understanding of it.

The arrow of time exists because we have found that fundamental physical laws that have time in them, cannot have negative numbers. The formula f=ma is the most important. The dimension a must be positive because the concept of negative force, (negative energy) is impossible, energy cannot be created. Time travel must be more complex than we might first think to get past this arrow of time. Perhaps the changing of the frequency of strings making up space and matter causes them to go back to previous time. This is in keeping with the notion that one raises the frequency of spirit and matter to transit from one world to another.

Thanks for visiting the alternate reality in the outer limits of mine, I now return you to your familiar reality.

[calikid]

Burroughs had two encounters, one with Sgt. Penniston and later, one with Col. Halt.

No doubt both times he witnessed something extraordinary, but I'm not clear which encounter resulted in possible contact?

The encounter with Penniston seemed to involve time dilation.
They were on scene much longer, external clock time, than they experienced/perceived.

But the encounter with Col Halt did involve blue and white lights.

Portions of the recovered memories involved overcoming some form of block, "I'm trying to remember, but the white light keeps saying 'NO!'"

Trying to figure out which one???

[majicbar]

Burroughs had two encounters, one with Sgt. Penniston and later, one with Col. Halt.

No doubt both times he witnessed something extraordinary, but I'm not clear which encounter resulted in possible contact?

The encounter with Penniston seemed to involve time dilation.
They were on scene much longer, external clock time, than they experienced/perceived.

But the encounter with Col Halt did involve blue and white lights.

Portions of the recovered memories involved overcoming some form of block, "I'm trying to remember, but the white light keeps saying 'NO!'"

Trying to figure out which one???

From what I have read I think it more likely that the second encounter with Col. Halt is the one more likely where Burrows had his white light experience inside the craft. He has offered little from the encounter of the craft with Penniston. This does not mean that nothing happened but the tendency of craft to take a person and create screen memory blocks to remembering the experience are making direct recollection impossible, and hypnotic memory is also problematic as these screens seem designed to throw off that recollection as well.

[newyorklily]

Burroughs had two encounters, one with Sgt. Penniston and later, one with Col. Halt.

No doubt both times he witnessed something extraordinary, but I'm not clear which encounter resulted in possible contact?

The encounter with Penniston seemed to involve time dilation.
They were on scene much longer, external clock time, than they experienced/perceived.

But the encounter with Col Halt did involve blue and white lights.

Portions of the recovered memories involved overcoming some form of block, "I'm trying to remember, but the white light keeps saying 'NO!'"

Trying to figure out which one???


From what I have read I think it more likely that the second encounter with Col. Halt is the one more likely where Burrows had his white light experience inside the craft. He has offered little from the encounter of the craft with Penniston. This does not mean that nothing happened but the tendency of craft to take a person and create screen memory blocks to remembering the experience are making direct recollection impossible, and hypnotic memory is also problematic as these screens seem designed to throw off that recollection as well.

Go to the 1:00:00 mark.

http://www.theparacast.com/podcast/now-playing-june-21-2009-john-burroughs-and-peter-robbins/

[calikid]

Go to the 1:00:00 mark.

http://www.theparacast.com/podcast/now-playing-june-21-2009-john-burroughs-and-peter-robbins/

Sorry NYL, but the link will not let me fast forward, and I don't have an hour to spend right now.
Can you share the content/brief synopsis in a post?
Thanks

[calikid]

I have been taking it that several "alien", "future" entities may have been conducting operations over these nights. My take is that the "Penniston" contact was a craft from "our" future. The other sightings of lights and more ephemeral craft were multi-dimensional and more truly alien. It seems to me that there was some kind of "intervention" taking place, maybe perhaps something would have taken place but they came to take these nukes off-line and unusable, thus avoiding some outcome that changed the history timelines in a desirable way for them. Perhaps there is an exception to the hands off rule when there is intervention that closes negative timelines. This however might cause big problems when dealing with consequences with souls on the other side and the karmic implications of the development of souls in timelines that are changed. In the all universal multiverses concept this seems heavy handed as those timelines that are changed for our benefit are still there and lived, if that concept is valid: maybe not?

Will try not to get to far OT.
In the sequence of events, Col Halt and John Burroughs saw the lights in the forrest, the craft moved off toward the weapons storage area where it shot "beams of light" to the ground. But on the way, it passed the Control Tower.

One of the reasons I suspected camouflage had to do with the Air Traffic Controller's testimony.
Mst Sgt. Ike Barker was the supervisor that night in Bentwaters' Control Tower.
From the testimony I heard (Paranormal Witness S03E20 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNu7anEI56Q) about 32min mark), he stated the "object" was very large and hovered just outside the glass of his tower.
In the re-creation, it was a silent, solid, VERY large structured object.
Not some glowing orb, shooting off sparks.
I still suspect distraction techniques in play to dazzle/distract on lookers while the occupants got their bearings and moved on to their true goal of (apparently) locating the Nuclear Storage area.

So witnesses viewing from a distance saw strange lights.
The witnesses close up and personal (Penniston one night, Barker the next night) saw structured craft.

[newyorklily]

Sorry NYL, but the link will not let me fast forward, and I don't have an hour to spend right now.
Can you share the content/brief synopsis in a post?
Thanks

During the last hour Burroughs talks about going into the field with Bustinza when the white light comes down. Bustinza was knocked to the ground and felt like he was being held there. Burroughs went further until he fell to the ground under the white light. The next thing he remembers is standing up and everything is fine. In the rest of the interview, Burroughs talks about his hypnosis sessions and the extra information that came out of the sessions.

I like this interview because it was recorded in 2009. This is prior to the binary codes and book deal.

[majicbar]

Will try not to get to far OT.
In the sequence of events, Col Halt and John Burroughs saw the lights in the forrest, the craft moved off toward the weapons storage area where it shot "beams of light" to the ground. But on the way, it passed the Control Tower.

One of the reasons I suspected camouflage had to do with the Air Traffic Controller's testimony.
Mst Sgt. Ike Barker was the supervisor that night in Bentwaters' Control Tower.
From the testimony I heard (Paranormal Witness S03E20 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNu7anEI56Q) about 32min mark), he stated the "object" was very large and hovered just outside the glass of his tower.
In the re-creation, it was a silent, solid, VERY large structured object.
Not some glowing orb, shooting off sparks.
I still suspect distraction techniques in play to dazzle/distract on lookers while the occupants got their bearings and moved on to their true goal of (apparently) locating the Nuclear Storage area.

So witnesses viewing from a distance saw strange lights.
The witnesses close up and personal (Penniston one night, Barker the next night) saw structured craft.

This has reminded me of something that I read in connection with the case of the "California Drones" and the cloaking/invisibility that was supposedly involved with them. I believe it was from a witness who had written to Linda Moulton Howe and was stating that the cloaking from a distance would either hide a craft, or would leave only lights in place of the object, when one was close enough cloaking was not effective and the craft would be seen, most clearly when it was right upon you. This seems like the same thing with the Rendlesham incident.

[calikid]

During the last hour Burroughs talks about going into the field with Bustinza when the white light comes down. Bustinza was knocked to the ground and felt like he was being held there. Burroughs went further until he fell to the ground under the white light. The next thing he remembers is standing up and everything is fine. In the rest of the interview, Burroughs talks about his hypnosis sessions and the extra information that came out of the sessions.

I like this interview because it was recorded in 2009. This is prior to the binary codes and book deal.
Are you saying that the binary code press has Burroughs displaying attention seeking behavior?
Maybe jealous of Pennistons press?

[majicbar]

Sorry NYL, but the link will not let me fast forward, and I don't have an hour to spend right now.
Can you share the content/brief synopsis in a post?
Thanks

Working the pause/play I was able to select the time of starting replay, the part where I found Burrows talking about the hypnosis was at 1:09:40, he says they will come back, he talks of a 2012 - 2015 timeframe at 1:15:30. Burrows does not say much about this but given the tensions between Russia and the U.S. at the present time it would seem prescient for some kind of interaction with them again as accidental /stupid war of nuclear exchange would seem again possible. The story he is telling is much the same as what is on the website for the book.

[newyorklily]

Are you saying that the binary code press has Burroughs displaying attention seeking behavior?
Maybe jealous of Pennistons press?

No, that is not what I'm saying. I'm saying that the interview was at a time when there were less variables to cloud and confuse the truth. The best time to get evidence and take statements is as close to the event as possible.

Just a few years ago, everyone was all focused ton Penniston's binary codes and the new Rendlesham book coming out. I prefer to look before those kind of diversions and focus on the original evidence. Every time you bring a memory to consciousness it changes ever so slightly. The further back you go on the timeline, the less changes there are.

[calikid]

No, that is not what I'm saying. I'm saying that the interview was at a time when there were less variables to cloud and confuse the truth. The best time to get evidence and take statements is as close to the event as possible.

Just a few years ago, everyone was all focused ton Penniston's binary codes and the new Rendlesham book coming out. I prefer to look before those kind of diversions and focus on the original evidence. Every time you bring a memory to consciousness it changes ever so slightly. The further back you go on the timeline, the less changes there are.

So you feel the earlier testimony is more reliable.
I can't disagree, but if any of the recovered memories are valid we are looking at an expanded collection of evidence to research with the new interviews.
Guess the tricky part is to judge IF the new evidence is valid. :confused:

[Fore]

Burroughs had two encounters, one with Sgt. Penniston and later, one with Col. Halt.

No doubt both times he witnessed something extraordinary, but I'm not clear which encounter resulted in possible contact?

The encounter with Penniston seemed to involve time dilation.
They were on scene much longer, external clock time, than they experienced/perceived. Perfect observation.


But the encounter with Col Halt did involve blue and white lights. I usually see blue lights in the context of the observer being in a state of phasing. Or they could be so close to the craft that things appear to be blue shifted...until....it is no longer the case.


Portions of the recovered memories involved overcoming some form of block, "I'm trying to remember, but the white light keeps saying 'NO!'"

Trying to figure out which one???One important factor to review is whether there is clear evidence that the experiencers have been "interfaced with" and to what degree.

Reading some of the hypnosis notes that were short and to the point leads me to recognize that they show clear signs that they had been (or ultimately) interfaced with by occupants of the craft. Even if the observers on the ground did not see the occupants from their vantage point.

The way the hypnosis session goes gives a clear indicator that at least one of them had their memories altered. The mind of one of the hypnosis sessions kept recalling something else other than what was being asked. So I assume that was what the ET's I knew referred to as a pointers play. I think the UFO researchers call them screen memories. I am unsure. There is also substitution-after-the-fact-of-observation that ET's can rely on to prevent access to certain kinds of memories.

One of them also had signs of being "handled" mentally if their accounts are accurate. It didn't sound like they were talking about an event in the past but of a cyclical thought process that keeps occupying/interrupting their mind and repeating and reinforcing itself. Sounds like Handiwork from a telepathic ET.

Another point is how (I think it was Pennington) is said to have spoken during the start of one of the encounters as if he were a cooperative element to an encounter who was exaggeratedly calm. Which tells you pretty much that he had already been interfaced with before that described encounter even took place.

Since I am not familiar with the case and all the people in it, I can't pin the right names on all of that. But I would take the earliest elements at face value and the later elements with caution and ample care to understand any obfuscation that might have taken place with all parties involved.

[newyorklily]

One important factor to review is whether there is clear evidence that the experiencers have been "interfaced with" and to what degree.

Reading some of the hypnosis notes that were short and to the point leads me to recognize that they show clear signs that they had been (or ultimately) interfaced with by occupants of the craft. Even if the observers on the ground did not see the occupants from their vantage point.

The way the hypnosis session goes gives a clear indicator that at least one of them had their memories altered. The mind of one of the hypnosis sessions kept recalling something else other than what was being asked. So I assume that was what the ET's I knew referred to as a pointers play. I think the UFO researchers call them screen memories. I am unsure. There is also substitution-after-the-fact-of-observation that ET's can rely on to prevent access to certain kinds of memories.

One of them also had signs of being "handled" mentally if their accounts are accurate. It didn't sound like they were talking about an event in the past but of a cyclical thought process that keeps occupying/interrupting their mind and repeating and reinforcing itself. Sounds like Handiwork from a telepathic ET.

Another point is how (I think it was Pennington) is said to have spoken during the start of one of the encounters as if he were a cooperative element to an encounter who was exaggeratedly calm. Which tells you pretty much that he had already been interfaced with before that described encounter even took place.

Since I am not familiar with the case and all the people in it, I can't pin the right names on all of that. But I would take the earliest elements at face value and the later elements with caution and ample care to understand any obfuscation that might have taken place with all parties involved.

One of the problems is that the witnesses were "debriefed" after the events by men in suits using hypnosis and sodium pentothal. Burroughs said in the interview above that he doesn't remember being debriefed but that he is trying to sort out what was real and what was created. Burroughs said that he finally undergone hypnosis in 1988 because Penniston was circulating a rumor that Burroughs was floated into the craft. Larry Warren also says he was not debriefed and claims that sodium amytal was used on the others.

Perhaps those men in suits chose different drugs to use with the hypnosis, depending on what was needed. Sodium amytal can make one more susceptible to false memories. Scopolamine (not mentioned in any of the Rendlesham interviews that I know of) can wipe out the memories from before it was administered.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amobarbital

http://io9.com/5902559/what-truths-does-truth-serum-actually-reveal

I think it is more likely that humans created screen (or false) memories than did ETs.
.

[calikid]

One of the problems is that the witnesses were "debriefed" after the events by men in suits using hypnosis and sodium pentothal. Burroughs said in the interview above that he doesn't remember being debriefed but that he is trying to sort out what was real and what was created. Burroughs said that he finally undergone hypnosis in 1988 because Penniston was circulating a rumor that Burroughs was floated into the craft. Larry Warren also says he was not debriefed and claims that sodium amytal was used on the others.

Perhaps those men in suits chose different drugs to use with the hypnosis, depending on what was needed. Sodium amytal can make one more susceptible to false memories. Scopolamine (not mentioned in any of the Rendlesham interviews that I know of) can wipe out the memories from before it was administered.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amobarbital

http://io9.com/5902559/what-truths-does-truth-serum-actually-reveal

I think it is more likely that humans created screen (or false) memories than did ETs.
.

Pretty sad when you take your own troops, men sworn to protect the constitution, and abuse them in that fashion.
As if the encounter wasn't trauma enough.
I'm guessing the men did not have much choice in volunteering for the debrief. :rolleyes:
Cannot help but wonder, were they chemically interrogated to break ET's block?
Or place a USG's block?

[newyorklily]

Pretty sad when you take your own troops, men sworn to protect the constitution, and abuse them in that fashion.
As if the encounter wasn't trauma enough.
I'm guessing the men did not have much choice in volunteering for the debrief. :rolleyes:
Cannot help but wonder, were they chemically interrogated to break ET's block?
Or place a USG's block?
Don't know. Maybe both?

Sent from my LGLS660 using Tapatalk

[Wansen]

Pretty sad when you take your own troops, men sworn to protect the constitution, and abuse them in that fashion.
As if the encounter wasn't trauma enough.
I'm guessing the men did not have much choice in volunteering for the debrief. :rolleyes:
Cannot help but wonder, were they chemically interrogated to break ET's block?
Or place a USG's block?

It's not often understood even by men/women in uniform that you are government property.

Remember "G.I." Joe? The "G.I." Stands for "Government Issue" aka "Government Property".

I have seen sailors and marines get drunk on liberty, pass out on the beach and become so badly sunburned that they were unable to report for duty (layed up in sickbay) then be formally charged under the UCMJ. The charge? "Damaging Government Property" - one's self!

In short, we were chattels.

[calikid]

It's not often understood even by men/women in uniform that you are government property.

Remember "G.I." Joe? The "G.I." Stands for "Government Issue" aka "Government Property".

I have seen sailors and marines get drunk on liberty, pass out on the beach and become so badly sunburned that they were unable to report for duty (layed up in sickbay) then be formally charged under the UCMJ. The charge? "Damaging Government Property" - one's self!

In short, we were chattels.

Prefer to think of them as a precious resource.
Not to be abused or squandered.