The Big Debate

[newyorklily]

If you truly believe that we live in a society where the 'rights of the people come first' you are either in denial or an idiot. I had already surmised that but thanks for the authentication. And further, if you think this is a "free speech forum" I suggest you withhold judgement until this free speecher is summarily banned. It won't be long.

"Free speech" is for everyone, not just those with the biggest and foulest mouths.

It is based on the Golden Rule: "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you". If a person is a masochist then that will be how they treat others as well. I'm sure there are many forums on the web where it is perfectly fine to hurt and abuse others with the written word and where homage is given to those with diarrhea of the mouth. The OutPost is not one of them. Respect is given here and it is expected in return. If the Golden Rule is followed with respect in mind, then the poster will have a long and enjoyable time here. That is when Free Speech rules!

[murmur]

People are going to tire of endless wars.

Israel can take care of itself

[Redbone]

What do I want? I want confiscation of excessive wealth and a redistribution to the poor. I want rich men to pass through the eyes of needles to trim the fat. I want a quadrupling of the death tax. Let the dead serve the living. I want a halving of the war budget and a closing of the all foreign military bases. I want a free education through the 16th grade. I want Donald Trump to mow my lawn. I want the peace corps to replace the marine corps. I want the Palistinians to have their own state. I want Bush, Chaney and Rummy to be tried by a tribunal in Iraq and hanged. I want corporate thieves and banksters to share a dormitory with Bernie Madoff. I want a general strike and a boycott of all useless consumption. I want strong laws that will ensure the preservation of the planet and certain justice for the despoilers. I want the poor in spirit and the makers of peace to be blessed and for the meek to inherit the world.

That's about it. You?

Neither of my parents ever finished school. They raised five kids in a modest home. I was taught never to take anything that did not belong to me and be thankful for what I had. If I saw something that I wanted, I worked hard and saved. If one job wasn't enough, I took a second. My family could not afford to send me to college, so I joined the Navy. Did my fours years, got out, got a full time job and went to night school. GI Bill paid for part of my schooling and I paid for the rest.

I got married, raised three kids, taught them to never take anything that did not belong to them, work hard to achieve your dreams. All three are college grads.

I have a 6 year old grandson.......quess what his dad is teaching him?

It is not that hard. Takes some effort, a lot of hard work, but it is achievable.

It is called the American dream.......The dream is not dead.........just the dreamers!

It died the minute we started asking for handouts!

[rdunk]

Redbone, you said a really lot, in just a few words. You just covered it in an excellent way. So many of us have been there and done that, just as with you and your family. I am not sure when the term "American dream" started, or who started it. But, if there were times when it wasn't vocalized, we just knew going beyond high school cost extra, and not everyone could afford it. And that was ok, because a significant percentage of jobs do not require a college degree. While some jobs do require specialized training, many jobs are OJT jobs. And that (OJT) would be On the Job Training, for younger folks here who haven't been introduced to that yet.

We started to work, always with an eye to the future, expecting to earn advancement in whatever our endeavors were/are. "Handouts" to seniors and handicapped is one thing. Continuing handouts to employable citizens and alien immigrants must come to a stop, in addition to a significant reduction to US foreign aid, especially to our "non friend" countries.

I believe the American Dream can be revived, but it is going to take a complete reversal of some of the actions implemented by the current administration, as well as reversing some actions of prior administrations.

LET'S JUST DO IT!

[noot]

The American dream has 300,000,000 variations. That's what the pursuit of happiness is all about. My own dream is of a nation and a world that lives by the principles of the Beatitudes. Such a dream precludes and eclipses the petty greed of capitalism in deference to the grand greed of common ownership. It's all about Loaves and Fishes in my dream. You probably pay it lip service on Sunday while inviting those who practice it to leave the country on Monday. Such is life.

[noot]

People are going to tire of endless wars.

Israel can take care of itself

I agree. But the real problem is the shallow tenor of American debate on this issue- and on all issues. You see that ogre of categorical Americanism right here in this thread. That's the idol that Ron is trying to smash. It may be impossible since Americananity has become a religion. You know how difficult it is to overcome zealotry and the lust for cheap toys...

[murmur]

Nothing worthwhile is easy

It's hard in fact.

[noot]

Nothing worthwhile is easy

It's hard in fact.

This applies in particular to the breaking of idols of the mind. It's always scary to break with the herd.

[murmur]

This applies in particular to the breaking of idols of the mind. It's always scary to break with the herd.

Like the Obama herd?

[noot]

All herds.