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Thread: Corona Virus and Disclosure - Public Reactions

  1. #121
    Here is an interesting 2:20 . . .

    https://twitter.com/NeilClark66/stat...81814295961600

    ALL drugs have side effects!!!
    Last edited by epo333; 07-30-2020 at 12:41 AM.

  2. #122
    BILL GATES ON COVID VACCINES: STRAIGHT FROM THE HORSE'S MOUTH

    https://www.bitchute.com/video/yFSdmpqUt6YF/

    Since I couldn't say anything about Bill Gates, here are the words right out of his mouth. He's not a doctor and yet gives us medical advice and advice to other organizations.
    A fantastic journey begins with curiosity

  3. #123
    Lead Moderator calikid's Avatar
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    It's a good thing vaccination is voluntary.
    If a person feels the danger outweighs the benefits, they can simply opt out.
    I would read the side effects listed that the clinical trials revealed, and then decide if this vaccine was for me or wait for the next one (there are a reported 25 COVID19 vaccines under development).
    Another factor for me, the infection rate is skyrocketing and I am among the high risk group. Older with breathing issues. Would a potentially life saving vaccine with side effects be preferable to ending up on a ventilator?
    Guess I'll have to wait and see what side effects we are actually talking about. At this point, a little bit like the cart before the horse.
    The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but
    progress. -- Joseph Joubert
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  4. #124
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...s-_UontrGWmX_c

    Check this out from our own government website.
    A fantastic journey begins with curiosity

  5. #125
    Lead Moderator calikid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spacemaverick View Post
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...s-_UontrGWmX_c

    Check this out from our own government website.
    As I mentioned earlier in an earlier post, the study you reference is 15 years old on a similar but different virus, and does not have any bearing on COVID-19.
    There are more recent (2020) studies. Studies that do not show HCQ having an affect on COVID-19. HCQ was neither curative or prophylactic.
    The newer studies also showed HCQ can cause fatal heart arrhythmia.
    But if you can convince your doctor to give it to you (off label use) feel free. The President did, after listening to claims made by Dr. Stella Immanuel. To put it mildly, a doctor with some unusual claims to her credit.
    Without getting too political, you'd think if the President was so convinced of the benifits he would have his medical teams running more trials to prove the efficacy of HCQ.
    We don't see that happening because several trails have already concluded HCQ does not work on COVID-19.
    The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but
    progress. -- Joseph Joubert
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  6. #126
    I haven't needed anything so far. So far all I see are several studies going on for this one strain. From what I have heard there are several strains of coronavirus. If they di come up with a vaccine, will it be sufficient for the strain that is circulating now? Viruses do mutate according to what the recognized medical experts say. Will the vaccine be for just this strain and only work for this strain? I personally don't think one vaccine is the silver bullet. The flu has several strains and they (medical people) more or less have to guess what strain will be prevalent each year. I have heard this from our local medical people at our local hospitals. So I think that if they come up with a vaccine, it will only be the strain they dealing with now. Just my opinion. These research doctors are not down in the trenches and I wonder when was the last time they actually treated any patients? Yes, there are side effects of any man-made medicines and they can't know all the side effects. So, there are unknown side effects and I believe you can't test for all side effects. 1. If we get a vaccine, will it only treat one strain of corona? 2. What will the side effects be on certain people? 3. Will certain people not be able to take the vaccine because of one of the side effects? There are tests that will find out what you can and cannot take as far as medicines are concerned. I have seen it posted in my Primary Doctors office. They take a swab, get a sample of your DNA and send it off to one of the big well known labs and supposedly can determine what medicines you can take and which you will have side effects. So many variables and several sources say we need a vaccine quickly. Hopefully, they perform a half baked study and just throw it out there. Meanwhile people are dying from it everyday. So, why not allow the doctors treat their patients how they know best until they developed a vaccine? Let the patient give or not give their permission.
    A fantastic journey begins with curiosity

  7. #127
    Lead Moderator calikid's Avatar
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    Quite a large post SM. I'm going to have to parse it out as time permits.
    Let me start by saying you make some good points, and on first blush, I don't disagree on any one particular point.
    What I don't understand is where you are going with this?
    Are you saying that since more than one strain of COVID19 exist (as evidenced by the Hunan vs European strains) we should abandon the current search for a vaccine?
    The time line for vaccine research involves a time consuming 4 phases (assures medication is efficient and safe). After months of research there are currently 2 candidates in Phase3.
    Wouldn't it make more sense to investigate if these MIGHT also be effective against the other strains, rather than starting from scratch?
    If we need multiple Vaccines, as you pointed out is done with annual Flu shots, IMHO it would seem the best course of action would be to progress down the same research protocols and develop additional vaccinations.
    Rather than tear down the current efforts of some our our best & brightest to reduce the death and suffering that has befallen us, can't you contribute something that might help lead to a solution?
    The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but
    progress. -- Joseph Joubert
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  8. #128
    There are other doctors at the patient level that are using other therapies with success but the powers that be in their particular hospitals won't allow these therapies. The doctors that are independent have there own therapies that seem to work. This is based on where I live. These independent doctors are not part of a health corporation and seem to be doing fine with their therapies. There are many different types of coronaviruses as well as different flu strains. I have no issue with the development of a vaccine. My issue is to let INDEPENDENT doctors do their thing with their patients. There are a few governors sticking their nose in and saying doctors can't do this or that therapy. If you as a doctor work for a health corporation then your hands are tied. You do what you are told. My main point is for government and RESEARCH SCIENTISTS (From WHO and NIH are only 2 sources. There are doctors already using successful therapies....let them do it. Politicians and research scientists are not the only sources. Many doctors are using different therapies with success and they are being shot down because of what they are doing. The best thing is to treat your patient and just not say anything to the Medical Powers that be. (My solution; open up the possible therapies to some of the doctors on the ground (in the trenches that have found therapies that work). You don't have to stop vaccine trials but LISTEN to those in the trenches who are working with patients and having success.

    https://www.webmd.com/lung/coronavirus-strains#1

    Different strains in above link

    http://www.news-medical.net/news/202...0-strains.aspx

    Current strain has mutated about 30 times
    Last edited by spacemaverick; 08-02-2020 at 03:00 AM. Reason: additional information
    A fantastic journey begins with curiosity

  9. #129
    Lead Moderator calikid's Avatar
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    SM, it would seem your main objection would be the long time taken to get new treatments/medications approved.
    I would hope you would agree we not only need protection from snake-oil salesmen, but also from well-meaning people who fail to predict unintended consequences.
    Who can forget the awful events that accompanied ushering in the polo vaccine. The early vaccine that actually infect healthy people because the serum was not properly vetted/quality controlled?
    And who can forget the rash of horribly disfigured children, born with birth defects after their pregnant mothers took a new wonder "morning sickness" medication called Thalidomide?
    AFAIK, medical professionals that have an alternative therapy can apply for an experimental treatment protocol. If approved, and patients signed fully informed consent forms, the treatments can proceed.
    While the current protocols may be infuriatingly slow, they are designed to protect the safety and very lives of the people receiving the therapy.
    I know it is difficult to look at Russia rushing untested vaccines to market and wonder why we can't do the same thing. But in light of history, IMHO don't see ignoring current safeguards/protocols as a gamble worth taking.
    The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but
    progress. -- Joseph Joubert
    Attachment 1008

  10. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by calikid View Post
    SM, it would seem your main objection would be the long time taken to get new treatments/medications approved.
    I would hope you would agree we not only need protection from snake-oil salesmen, but also from well-meaning people who fail to predict unintended consequences.
    Who can forget the awful events that accompanied ushering in the polo vaccine. The early vaccine that actually infect healthy people because the serum was not properly vetted/quality controlled?
    And who can forget the rash of horribly disfigured children, born with birth defects after their pregnant mothers took a new wonder "morning sickness" medication called Thalidomide?
    AFAIK, medical professionals that have an alternative therapy can apply for an experimental treatment protocol. If approved, and patients signed fully informed consent forms, the treatments can proceed.
    While the current protocols may be infuriatingly slow, they are designed to protect the safety and very lives of the people receiving the therapy.
    I know it is difficult to look at Russia rushing untested vaccines to market and wonder why we can't do the same thing. But in light of history, IMHO don't see ignoring current safeguards/protocols as a gamble worth taking.
    They need to obtain permission (if they work for a hospital or health agency) to obtain an experimental treatment protocol. I am finding that the health system that I am in as a patient is very money-oriented rather than patient-oriented and that seems to be a problem. Of course, independent doctors sometimes face governors that ban the use of certain drugs that create an issue for some of these doctors to even obtain permission from the patient to do so. I di think we should have regulations in effect that prevent snake oil salespeople from pushing their products. I can't argue any points about WHO or any other medical authority because I don't have medical training or nowhere near the IQ of some of these so-called experts like Fauci who keeps changing his views. IF APPROVED is the biggie for these doctors who have already treated patients for breathing issues. If it's just a breathing issue instead of calling it COVID, they will use what they can to get the patient better and it usually works. I can only tell you what's happening where I live. Some of the powers that be politically are using this as a springboard for their own agenda. (my opinion only). Thanks for allowing me to continue with the conversation here.
    A fantastic journey begins with curiosity

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